Even if we accept that shootings just happened to begin after the Schempp decision (which isn't true; it's not hard to find school shootings from before then. They just weren't as sensationalized), correlation and causation are two very different things. Personally, I'd say that it's the religious bullies who were an important factor in why the Columbine shooting took place.
4/11/2012 3:41:34 AM
"You reap what you sow, more than you sow and later than you sow."
I like "Paybacks are a bitch."
Pastor Stan talks like Donald Rumsfeld.
4/11/2012 4:03:23 AM
Something happened 46 years ago! Everything bad ever since is cuz God is MAD!
4/11/2012 4:20:35 AM
As Colbert said, "Gun violence keeps going up, even though we're buying more guns. I just don't get it!"
While religious fundamentalism and gun fetishism might be related, the USA needs to realise that they appear cartoonishly ignorant to the rest of the developed world when it comes to gun ownership, and the brutality that ensues because of it is at horrifyingly high levels. There needs a serious overhaul of the related laws, and damn soon.
That said, Verisimilitude desperately needs a knew moniker.
4/11/2012 4:28:29 AM
Another poster in the thread says, "There is no dress code. They are allowed to WEAR SHORTS!". Clearly a ticket straight to Hell.
4/11/2012 4:41:36 AM
School shootings before 1964.
Pastor stanly is full of shit.
4/11/2012 5:54:22 AM
Never mind that nobody ever banned prayer in public schools. It's just not forced on anyone anymore. But, we are dealing with Christian Logic® here, aren't we?
4/11/2012 6:32:13 AM
I am more and more convinced that fundies are right when they say that they are "not of this world". Fundies live in a cartoon version of history (a gory adult cartoon perhaps, but an animated fictional piece that doesn't resemble reality in any way nonetheless) where no school shootings ever took place before the 1960s (despite in reality having recorded cases all the way back to the 18th century), where they are the persecuted majority, where atheists, Muslims, gays, communists, and Nazis are all in cahoots together, and where the founders were all fundamentalist Christians despite the fact that they predated the fundamentalist movement. I don't know how such a large portion of this country's population has brains that have slipped so far outside of reality as to live in an alternate reality that is unrecognizable to anyone living in the real world and I don't know how we can possibly roll back the damage that this has done to us and will do in the near future.
4/11/2012 6:38:41 AM
IIRC, an autopsy performed on the 1966 UT sniper found a brain tumor in the killer's skull. It seems likely this was the cause of his murder spree. The tumor caused his brain to malfunction, leading him to do things he would not have done otherwise. The ending of teacher-led prayer in public schools had no bearing here.
Another cause and effect fail here at RR.
4/11/2012 6:58:56 AM
we are reaping what we sowed when we allowed prayer to be taken out of schools
By "we" you mean James Madison, the guy who wrote the First Amendment?
Fundie Beliefs #16 - The Value of Prayer
Prayers are especially effective when recited in unison in public school classrooms. Praying at home before or after school doesn’t have the same effect, which is why it’s important for good Christians to get the public school prayer ban lifted and reinstitute the saying of the Lord’s Prayer*. It’s well known that if Bible-believing Christians force the children of godless, latte-sipping liberals to recite the Protestant "Our Father" in unison every morning it guarantees they won't grow up into queers, vegetarians or Democrats.
* The King James Protestant version, of course. Only a papist leaves out the “for thine is the kingdom …” part.
4/11/2012 7:11:02 AM
"I believe it was back in the early 1960's that prayer was taken out of the schools by our supreme court."
Exactly how many times do we have to tell you that prayer was not taken out of schools. Students are free to pray any damn time they'd like, so long as they're not disruptive, etc.
Teachers and other faculty cannot lead prayers or make them mandatory, etc. if the school is publicly funded.
"Now instead of prayer in schools, we have guns."
Well, it's better than those Damned Commies you guys kept saying would infiltrate the education system without prayer to fend them off.
"When this happened in August of 1966, 16 people were killed at the University of Texas. People were shocked and outraged. This wasn't the first incident of this sort, but it was very notable for the number of people murdered. School shootings continued after this, mostly on a small scale. I don't remember school shootings ever making the national news until 1999 with the Columbine school shooting. Since then, including today, I can find 79 more school shootings in the US. They are on the increase."
Someone not too long ago posted a link--probably to Wikipedia--showing school shootings going back to the late 1800s, I believe. Certainly they were happening throughout the early 20th century. You're just cherry picking your data, which is a no-no.
Pastor Stanley has been proven correct. Prayer was taken out of the schools and Satan has been allowed in. He's taken up residence and we are reaping what we sowed when we allowed prayer to be taken out of schools. The number of schools shootings is on the increase so we are reaping more than we sowed. It's been about 50 years since prayer was taken out of the schools so we are reaping later than we sowed. We sowed to the wind when we took prayer out of the schools. Now our schools are reaping the whirlwind."
Your mastery of hyperbole is astounding.
4/11/2012 7:15:24 AM
I find your argument to be "sow sow'.
4/11/2012 7:36:05 AM
Somebody posted really good statistics about this in a similar thread a while back.
The first school shooting in the US was back in the 1700s and the rate has remained pretty steady every decade since.
The numbers have only increased in line with the increase in population and the availability and effectiveness of guns in public hands.
4/11/2012 7:57:26 AM
Take a moment to consider Andrew Kehoe before talking about school violence.
4/11/2012 8:19:06 AM
Say, we've already refuted this point once before! I redirect all complaints to that other page.
4/11/2012 8:20:10 AM
Pray in school if you want, no one fucking cares. Well, maybe we would snicker behind your back. All the Supreme Court decided was that our public institutions could not lead any prayers and promote one religion or denomination over another. Why is this so fucking hard to understand?
4/11/2012 8:25:36 AM
You can still pray in schools. I know you don't understand. It's quite complex for your primitive little brain. You can still pray in schools; the school just isn't allowed to force you to pray. You would think religious ass bags would be all about that since not everyone prays the same way.
Secondly, where do these kids get these guns? They don't manufacture themselves. I'll give you a hint -it's not atheists or left-wingers.
4/11/2012 8:44:52 AM
I wonder if anyone over at RR is familiar with The First Amendment.
4/11/2012 9:06:15 AM
Who here wants to bet this asshole supports the second amendment.
4/11/2012 9:12:33 AM
Yeah I went to public school in the 90s. Class of 99 actually. No mandatory prayer. And you know what? My school was a good school! Imagine that! It's as though the issues are not with prayer but with other issues going on in schools.
Side note: to those who are fans of the Silent Hill games and movie, anyone else think the cult sounds a LOT like RR especially Claudia and Leonard from SH3?
4/11/2012 9:28:27 AM
Regardless of the fact that, as pointed out this was a Christian school, there have been numerous school shootings, bombings, and killings since long before prayer was taken out of schools.
Try again retard.
4/11/2012 9:35:34 AM
No, the numbers of dead are going up because the guns are getting better. Decades of fairly consistent numbers of school shootings, in which the death toll rose and rose and rose.
The only use for automatic weapons fire is to mow down large numbers of people at once without much aiming. It is a weapon purely for war. The only reason citizens could need them is so as to be able to stand up to invasion (or zombies) or fight a civil war. Especially against the army, although IEDs would be involved, too, if we ever came to that, and the rebel forces would have to employ guerilla tactics, even more than our predecessors did. No private citizen is expected to be able to access tanks, or bombers, or anti-personnel mines, but the guns are guns, so we can get them.
Since we aren't having any domestic war, people who buy these tend to use them for mass murder.
Maybe we should be focusing on the well-ordered militia part a bit more?
4/11/2012 9:57:57 AM
"I believe it was back in the early 1960's that prayer was taken out of the schools by our supreme court"
Should have taken guns out as well. Would have been a lot less shootings.
4/11/2012 10:16:45 AM
ive got another correlation for you:
since the 50's, the states has been slowly cutting their public school funding. since then, school shootings have been on the rise, most notably 16 people at the university of texas, and the columbine shootings in 1999. ever since funding was cut, general intelligence has dropped, and bullying has increased. this means that a majority of the kids are stupid, aggressive, and intolerant(america, in a nutshell). they make the lives of more promising, intelligent students nothing less than a living hell for AT LEAST 6 years. they then get fed up and take it out on school bullies(teachers can be bullies too, even if it is only through inaction).
therefore, lack of funding is responsible for school shootings
4/11/2012 11:39:29 AM
Now instead of prayer in schools, we have guns.
If I understand correctly, you want to repeal the Second Amendment. Good! I'm all for it, get rid of theat nonsense today.
4/11/2012 11:57:23 AM